Western RPGs

This topic is the sister to the JRPG topic. Are there any Western RPG fans here? Do you have any favorites? Are you as crazy about modding these games as I am? (Insert 50 more questions about WRPGs here!)

If I was a late arrival to the JRPG genre, then I was a ridiculously late arrival to Western RPGs. Quite simply, I didn't even know that the "modern" WRPG existed or what it was until about 2015 when @zoop broadened my horizons.

I have played through the entire Mass Effect trilogy (including a fair amount of the DLC); I attempted and then completey quit Dragon Age; I played Fallout 4 (currently waiting for the modding community to catch up on this one, I am not fond of the core game).

However, my all time favorite WRPG is definitely Fallout: New Vegas, and I may have a few mods installed. Actually, I have over a hundred mods installed, at this point. And, yes, I do actually enjoy modding these games almost as much as I enjoy playing them. I don't make my own mods, but I do tweak and play around with everything that others make.

So, like, anyone else like WRPGs here? I saw mention of them at least once in the other topic, which is why I made this one.

I've played a few of these. Not a totally huge number, though.

Not counting things like Diablo and the like, I got my start in the genre with Neverwinter Nights series, which I rather enjoyed, and then to the Knights of the OId Republic series which I was also fairly fond of. More recently, I was a fan of the original Mass Effect trilogy (Andromeda be damned), and found Pillars of Eternity to be a fun romp - though I didn't actually finish the game due to, in my opinion, spectacularly poor pacing. It's a testament to all the things the game does right that I look back on it fondly, despite this.

I've never really been a fan of Bethesda games. I've tried every single modern Elder Scrolls game at one point or another, but have never really been able to get into them... the modern Fallout games as well just aren't my cup of tea. Similarly, I must confess to never having been a fan of old school Western RPGs like the original Fallout games, Baulder's Gate, Icewind Dale, etc... to be frank and shallow, they just aren't pretty enough.

Other than that... hrm... I played Dungeon Siege for a little while, before figuring out that it was a fairly bad game.

Currently I'm looking forward to the Pillars of Eternity follow-up, getting around to playing Tyranny, and ... actually, I think that's about it. I'd be all over a new Vampire: The Masquerade game, but that seems like a very, very long shot at this point.

I may have a few mods installed.

You spend more time modding that game than you do playing it. Jesus.

Now here's a topic I can really feel comfortable with. lol

I LOVE Mass Effect, or at least the original trilogy. I had over 300 hours put into the entire trilogy - and no, I'm not exaggerating. I can't remember how many times I've replayed the three games, albeit often with this one FemShep and no one else. This most frequently used FemShep had a ponytail and tanned skin, and kinda looks like an Asian too. I started her as a full Renegade in the first game, but some time when it came to the second game - my favorite of the trilogy btw - I had this headcanon roleplayed out where Shepard had a vision of her deliberately causing the deaths of all her crewmates, meaning that I killed just about everybody I could during the Suicide Mission. I then reloaded to Samara's loyalty mission, which is when my FemShep had that headcanon vision, and she stopped Morinth instead of helping her like in the vision. It was all supposed to be some kind of scheme Morinth planned to manipulate Shepard into killing every of her teammate so that she could get Shepard alone and, well, give her space-AIDs. lol It was a fun headcanon to roleplay out, and I didn't regret having to replay half of the game in a single playthrough. In fact, that's the only way I replayed Mass Effect 2 most of the times.

And ME2 was definitely my favorite RPG of all time. It has an amazing ensemble cast of characters. Most of them were so well-written, with the exception of Jacob of course. lol But still, even with Jacob considered, it's impressive just how much effort Bioware put into these 12 characters. Even the DLC characters had an interesting backstory! That's brilliant! Kasumi is one of my favorites in there, and it's a shame I couldn't romance her... :'(

Even the notorious ME3 wasn't terrible IMO. I love that the stakes were raised tremendously in the third game, and the emotional scenes were much more depressing. That scene where you have to choose between Tali and Legion in particular... heartwrenching. And Mordin's fate in ME3 makes him one of the most well-written characters in video game history, period. His entire character arc in ME3 was easily the best part of the game, whether if you went the Renegade route or Paragon. Personally, I liked the Paragon version much better, even though I tend to like Renegade actions myself.

Badass.

Oh, I could just play the original Mass Effect trilogy forever... If only Andromeda didn't suck as hard as it did. Sigh. Oh well.

Dragon Age. I have a funny relationship with Dragon Age. I love Origins. It has one of the best branching storyline you could ever find in WRPGs, period. No other WRPGs I've seen have choices that matter as much as Dragon Age, even the Mass Effect series. There's a lot of variety to the multiple endings that it's impossible for the sequels to incorporate those choices the way Mass Effect did. Understandably, the Ostagar arc at the beginning can feel incredibly boring (at least for me), so I could understand why some people never completed this game. I myself had a lot of trouble replaying Origins because of the dull Ostagar arc. After the incredibly interesting character origins, Ostagar seems almost anti-climatic.

Nevertheless, I'm glad I finally got myself to put up with it in order to get to the good parts, which didn't take a long time. The good parts in the main storyline after Lothering are really good IMO. So many fun choices to decide who live and die, whether to kill a kid or not. Dragon Age: Origins is one of the few games where you can choose to play a really evil character and it would still be canon. Mass Effect's Renegade doesn't count because that's more pragmatic than outright evil.

And then came Dragon Age II, which is when things really became funny. See, I never liked Dragon Age II till recently. Along with a lot of people, I thought its story was mediocre, and that it was a step-down from Origins in a lot of ways. But then I replayed it again in recent years, gave it another chance, and holy cow, Hawke became my second favorite player character since FemShep. It's amazing what a different perspective you can get with a replay. While I still think it's a step-down from Origins, I feel that its story of Kirkwall's conflict between the mages and templars was actually emotional enough to be worth at least one playthrough, especially if you're playing a mage-Hawke where the stakes become more personal for you as a character.

I would also advice playing as sarcastic Hawke rather than other personalities, as she has some of the funniest lines you'll find. The first time I played, I played as an aggressive Hawke, which was probably the reason the game felt more boring for me. Never tried diplomatic Hawke, but I would imagine that she would have a pretty boring and one-note personality too.

Unfortunately, as much fun as I had with DAII, Inquisition was where everything came crumbling down. There are so many problems I have with Inquisition. I hate the characters. They all either feel stale or have these weird tics that put me off from liking them. I hate the player character because she lacks the charm of Hawke and she can't be evil like in Origins. Most of all, I hate the pointless side quests that contribute very little to the main story. The worst part about this is that I couldn't just ignore them like I could in Mass Effect: Andromeda! You're forced to do the side quests in order to earn Power Points that you need to unlock the story further! Of course, I couldn't take it any longer after a while and just dropped the damn thing altogether. What a terrible way to end my experience with Dragon Age.

And then there is Fallout. I agree with you on New Vegas. Right after Mass Effect 2, it's my second favorite RPG of all time, mostly because... *drumroll* yep, because of all the choices and multiple endings. It's hard to say which game has the better branching storyline: Dragon Age: Origins or Fallout: New Vegas. On one hand, yes, you do have a wider variety of choices in New Vegas, but Origins did it better with slightly fewer choices because you could see the cinematic of those choices, and they're not just slideshows like New Vegas. Nevertheless, I love New Vegas all the same because of that variety. Playing evil was even more satisfying in New Vegas because, boy, it makes the kind of evil in Origins pale in comparison. I just wish New Vegas is much longer though, because I could have played forever if I could.

Last but not least, there's Alpha Protocol, an incredibly flawed game that is nonetheless very fun for a gamer like me. It's like the prototype version of Mass Effect, except with a lot more choices and consequences that matter. That's the selling point of Alpha Protocol, its choices actually matter, not just having the illusion of choice. This is mostly due to its developer being the same team as the ones who brought us New Vegas: Obsidian Entertainment. It's unfortunate that Obsidian never went back to fix all the bugs and glitches of the game. Otherwise, this could easily be a Game of the Year contender. The story is not amazing, but entertaining enough as a spy thriller the likes of James Bond. You also get to pick a love interest too, adding to the variety.

Honestly though, the RPG I could talk about all day long at the end is still Mass Effect. If there are any Mass Effect fans out there, give me a shout out. I might just consider creating a ME thread for you guys.

I am not as familiar with Western RPG's, mostly because I think the term is overused for games with light RPG elements. That said, there are a few I can recommend, and Mass Effect is not one of them, because I haven't played them.

Borderlands 1, 2, and the Pre-Sequel. The games are fun, the characters not so much, because most of them are pretty huge jerks but the gameplay is great and worth playing for that reason alone.

Witcher Series, namely 2 and 3. A lot of people don't talk about 2 but to understand 3 you really need to play it and it's a fine game. Witcher 3 however is great in terms of gameplay and the stories are good, just be aware that there is some nudity, which I don't know if that bothers you or not but they have it. That said, it's good series to play.

Horizon Zero Dawn. Honestly the best Western RPG out right now. The story is great, the combat is the most engaging I have ever played in action RPG, there is essentially no flaws in the game. It can be somewhat difficult at times, but that's what makes it all the more interesting, and it's absolutely gorgeous to boot, easily the best looking game on the PS4. If only ever play one Western RPG, make it this one.

If only Andromeda didn't suck as hard as it did. Sigh. Oh well.

Yeah, I didn't even mention Andromeda. I'm still really sour about how that turned out. I was desperate for entertainment, and the game seemed like it could POSSIBLY deliver some reasonable facsimile of a Mass Effect experience.

Well, I wasn't wrong, but the game was so buggy that it was unplayable. I mean really freaking unplayable. Every time my spouse tried to play the damn game, her computer would restart. In the middle of multiplayer matches, both of our computers would reboot. Yes, there was a bug in the game that actually shut down your computer. Like, wtf. How did that shit make it through testing?

And then there is Fallout. I agree with you on New Vegas.

I like New Vegas for slightly different reasons, I think. The modded game has very satisfying gun-play for a RPG. That lured me in. The massive quantity of mods and the vaguely open world experience were also quite awesome. Then, as someone born in Southern USA, I could appreciate the amusing Western vibe that stretched throughout the world.

Understandably, the Ostagar arc at the beginning can feel incredibly boring (at least for me), so I could understand why some people never completed this game. I myself had a lot of trouble replaying Origins because of the dull Ostagar arc. After the incredibly interesting character origins, Ostagar seems almost anti-climatic.

I struggled to play through Dragon Age: Origins. People keep talking about how its an amazing game, but no matter how many times I try, I get bored to tears by it. I've made it past Ostagar, actually, and even into the content that comes after Lothering. I cleared the Mage Circle thingy, dealt with the demon possessed kid, etc, etc. I was still bored, painfully bored. Maybe it's because I have played so many fantasy games, but I just couldn't get into Origins, even after trying quite a few times with different characters.

I struggled to play through Dragon Age: Origins. People keep talking about how its an amazing game, but no matter how many times I try, I get bored to tears by it. I've made it past Ostagar, actually, and even into the content that comes after Lothering. I cleared the Mage Circle thingy, dealt with the demon possessed kid, etc, etc. I was still bored, painfully bored. Maybe it's because I have played so many fantasy games, but I just couldn't get into Origins, even after trying quite a few times with different characters.

I think that calls for a "different strokes for different folks" conclusion then. My favorite part about Origins is the ability to roleplay a wide variety of characters due to the nuanced characters origins they get, whether it's a noble or a lowly commoner. This is further improved by the ambiguity of the morality in your choices. Yes, you can play an "evil" Warden, technically speaking, but I feel a lot of the decisions can be justified, roleplaying-wise, no matter how vile the choices are.

Furthermore, because each origin provides a different kind of roleplaying experience (different dialogue, different NPC reactions), it's a lot more fun to roleplay because it's like I'm playing a different character each time. This is something I wish a lot more WRPGs have, different classes providing more than just gameplay changes and actually have different dialogue and NPC reactions added. It adds to the flavor of roleplaying IMO.

And on that note, I feel that there are many RPGs that forgot the element of "roleplaying" in the "RP" of the RPG genre. They are more focused on improving statistics, combat mechanics and whatnot rather than the actual roleplay of an imaginary character you mold into your own. What I would like to see more are RPGs that allow you to more than just customize your appearance and combat style, but your personality and morality. I feel that's something sorely lacking from the roleplaying elements of RPGs that aren't Bioware or Obsidian games.

I think that calls for a "different strokes for different folks" conclusion then.

See, but I'm not sure if that really applies. I forgot to mention it in my post but I really, really enjoyed Dragon Age: Origins, and I'm quite likely to attempt to play through it again. That's kind of how I play RPGs - I try again and again until I like it. My opinion is, thus, not fully settled yet.

And on that note, I feel that there are many RPGs that forgot the element of "roleplaying" in the "RP" of the RPG genre. They are more focused on improving statistics, combat mechanics and whatnot rather than the actual roleplay of an imaginary character you mold into your own. What I would like to see more are RPGs that allow you to more than just customize your appearance and combat style, but your personality and morality. I feel that's something sorely lacking from the roleplaying elements of RPGs that aren't Bioware or Obsidian games.

I can agree with this. Sadly, though, can we even still include Bioware as a company that makes games like this? Andromeda is a terribly unpolished disasterpiece. Does it still count as Bioware actually giving a damn?

See, but I'm not sure if that really applies. I forgot to mention it in my post but I really, really enjoyed Dragon Age: Origins, and I'm quite likely to attempt to play through it again. That's kind of how I play RPGs - I try again and again until I like it. My opinion is, thus, not fully settled yet.

I've mentioned this before, and I apologize in advance if I'm beating a dead horse, but this really reminds me of my early experience with Origins. It's like, I love the story, I love the variety of roleplaying experience, but the combat mechanics put me off somewhat back then. I'll admit without shame that I'm a very casual gamer who have very shallow preferences when it comes to video games. I don't like 8-bit graphics, I don't like the isometric perspective of a lot of CRPGs (even existing in those created in recent years), and I don't like games that are deliberately difficult (Dark Souls). So when it comes to the combat of Origins, it did put me off at first, how there are so many spells and talents to choose from (this was a time when I just started out playing RPGs, so I was still uncomfortable with creating the proper build for my character because it requires so much effort and experience). And it's not just the combat, but other little things like how the pacing of the story can really drag sometimes and I would just want to get to the exciting part already, or the huge amount of bugs that were not fixed, or the really dull armor sets that were available (if you never applied modding, that is). Just little things that didn't manage to hook my interest enough.

But somehow or another, I managed to get back into it out of the sole interest for getting a good story. I remember my favorite scene in the game, when Leliana started singing after the "Werewolf" story arc ended. It was a tragic song, and I felt it conveyed the heavy stakes of the story very well, how there is so much sacrifice and death. It's because of emotional moments like this that kept me playing on, sticking around for the good parts. Also, the fact that I gave my female dwarf Warden a rather cute face might have something to do with it as well.

Anyway, what I'm trying to say in the end is, it's nice to hear that you'll give it a chance again in the future. Many people wouldn't even give half of that, so yeah, it's nice. Hopefully you'll come around to it like I did someday.

I can agree with this. Sadly, though, can we even still include Bioware as a company that makes games like this? Andromeda is a terribly unpolished disasterpiece. Does it still count as Bioware actually giving a damn?

Good point. I think their creative spark has been lost ever since Dragon Age: Inquisition was created. Most of the old teams that created the Bioware games we loved are gone, and I feel EA has something to do with this, taking over the company and doing whatever it wants with it to earn a lot of money in as little time as possible. The truth, of course, isn't as simple as some greedy corporate company churning out bad games, but I feel that with their track record, it's not hard to imagine EA being at fault for a lot of the creative decisions. It's the same kind of system as Hollywood and Hollywood executives really, and it doesn't even have to do with greed or avarice, but a faulty creative system nobody bothers to change.